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  1. #1
    Joomla Fan ozneilau's Avatar
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    Web Hosting Company Uptime Statistics
    I have an annoyed client after the recent VentraIP data center move in Sydney where there was an extended scheduled outage.

    I host my own website with VentraIP too but haven't noticed too many outages.

    I went looking for some comparative uptime statistics and found webhostingstuff dot com which monitors hosting companies own corporate websites. This doesn't necessarily correlate directly to their shared hosting or other server uptime statistics but presumably gives some indication.

    Here's what I found:

    Hosted in Australian Data Centres:

    • VentraIP: 99.95%
    • NetRegistry: 99.96%
    • Crucial Paradigm: 99.96%
    • Crazy Domains: 99.98%
    • Jumba: 99.98%
    • Panthur: 99.98%
    • AussieHQ: 99.99%


    Hosted in Overseas Data Centres:

    • SiteGround: 99.99%
    • RochenHost: 99.99%


    It looks like my client has a point although uptime statistics are only one of the features I would judge a web hosting company on.

    Maybe the move to the new data centre will improve VentraIP's statistics.

    [Edited as per suggestion from James. Thanks James!]
    Last edited by ozneilau; 25-03-2014 at 09:21 PM. Reason: Clarification

  2. #2
    Registered Provider Micron21's Avatar
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    Dear ozneilau

    Welcome to Web Hosting Talk Australia, and great information you have provided.

    One thing you might want to change is the wording “Australian Data Centres”

    None of the companies listed above are actual Datacentres they are all however hosting provides, even your Overseas Datacentres are also not datacentres again they are hosting providers.

    A Datacentre owns and controls the physical building where they take control of the entire physical infrastructure normally physical security, cooling, power and sometimes network capacity (That’s US, that's what we do here at Micron21)

    A datacentre then sells a level or a floor to a wholesale provider who then sells a cage area or racks to a middle man who then typically sells the space to a hosting provider.

    From memory.. happy to be corrected
    NetRegistry are in global switch datacentre Sydney
    Crucial are in Equinix datacentre Sydney
    Jumba and AussieHQ are in a TransACT datacentre Canberra
    Panthur are in Dedicated Servers Datacentre Brisbane
    Crazy Domains are in some datacentre in Perth
    Ventraip are in NextDC (M1 S1 B1) datacentres now (previously they were in a pipe datacentre which had issues)

    Also it would help to provide information on where you are collecting this information from ie how you are polling data and are you polling each facility from within Australia or external to Australia.

    Kindest Regards
    James
    Last edited by Micron21; 25-03-2014 at 08:02 PM.
    Outer East Melbourne Datacentre – Micron21 Pty Ltd
    Co Location – Dedicated Servers – Web Hosting – VMware Cloud Solutions – 24/7 Support
    Phone 1300 76 99 72 (Email) James@micron21.com
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  3. #3
    Joomla Fan ozneilau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micron21 View Post
    One thing you might want to change is the wording “Australian Data Centres”
    Thanks James! I have amended my original post along the lines you have suggested.

    Quote Originally Posted by Micron21 View Post
    Also it would help to provide information on where you are collecting this information from ie how you are polling data and are you polling each facility from within Australia or external to Australia.
    Excellent point! Australian servers are probably at a disadvantage if the polling is done from within the USA. It would be useful to me (and likely others) if there were some similar locally collected statistics.

  4. #4
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    http://status.mammoth.net.au/uptime-history

    I dont know why this is not more common.

  5. #5
    Joomla Fan ozneilau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MammothVPS View Post
    I dont know why this is not more common.
    Thanks! You have some pretty impressive stats there.

    No doubt most hosting companies would be collecting this information but maybe not so willing to share!

  6. #6
    VentraIP Australia Cheyne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozneilau View Post
    I have an annoyed client after the recent VentraIP data center move in Sydney where there was an extended scheduled outage.
    I hope you informed your client of the outage!

    Unfortunately this one was one of absolute necessity. We HAD to get out of that PIPE facility because of the issues they were having with the facility itself, and the fact that despite being told before we moved in there that 'carriers would be building within 12 months' that of course never happened.

    I host my own website with VentraIP too but haven't noticed too many outages.
    There shouldn't be many if at all, and I can tell you with absolute honesty that over the past 12 months since we have installed the new Dell servers that number of issues has decreased significantly.

    Also, our DDoS mitigation is now on 24/7 and without the need to re-route local traffic via the US.

    I went looking for some comparative uptime statistics and found webhostingstuff dot com which monitors hosting companies own corporate websites. This doesn't necessarily correlate directly to their shared hosting or other server uptime statistics but presumably gives some indication.
    The problem with these kind of stats is that they don't take in to account scheduled maintenance like the window we had on the weekend for the data centre move. Every host in the world needs to schedule maintenance for some reason or another!

    Maybe the move to the new data centre will improve VentraIP's statistics.
    I believe it will, but the data centre move is just one part of what we 'upgraded' last weekend.

    We now have a new network in place in Sydney, powered by shiny new Brocade hardware with more transit and peering providers and that all adds to our overall stability. Going from those stats, we are trying to improve by 0.05% to make it to the magic 100 and any teething issues aside I think we can achieve that if not go very close.

    But as you have rightly pointed out, the uptime of our web site compared to that of a shared hosting server is going to be very different.

    If you have any specific questions you are welcome to send me a private message and I will be happy to answer them for you.
    Cheyne Jonstone
    Executive Chairman
    http://www.ventraip.com.au

  7. #7
    Joomla Fan ozneilau's Avatar
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    Thanks for contributing to the discussion Cheyne!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheyne View Post
    I hope you informed your client of the outage!
    My client has service status emails enabled and I have now enabled SMS alerts too.

    I understand the need for scheduled maintenance and appreciate the efforts VentaIP go to to keep servers up to date. One of the main reasons I moved clients to VentraIP was because my previous preferred web hosting company was so far out of date with PHP versions that I couldn't install the latest version of Joomla at the time.

    I noticed when signed in to a different client's SiteGround account today that uptime statistics are published in the SiteGround client control panel (see attached). I am wondering if VentraIP collect this type of information and if so, can this be viewed by clients or the the general public?

    I hope to see your uptime statistics improve and wish you all the best.
    Attachments Pending Approval Attachments Pending Approval

  8. #8
    Registered Provider Exigent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheyne View Post
    Also, our DDoS mitigation is now on 24/7 and without the need to re-route local traffic via the US.
    It is a little interesting to hear Cheyne.

    I believe you guys use Black Lotus for your DDoS protection and Black Lotus actually doesn't have any hardware here in Australia. This would only indicate to us that you would have to reroute your traffic internationally to have it cleaned and then to have it sent back to you VIA international transit.

    Correct me if I'm wrong but VentraIP does in fact reroute it's traffic internationally to have it cleaned by Black Lotus as VentraIP does not own any DDoS protection hardware itself.
    Last edited by Exigent; 27-03-2014 at 10:23 AM.
    www.exigent.com.au :: sales@exigent.com.au :: 1300 252 080
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  9. #9
    VentraIP Australia Cheyne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exigent View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong
    With pleasure.

    but VentraIP does in fact reroute it's traffic internationally to have it cleaned by Black Lotus
    Nope, not anymore. We haven't had to do this for several months now.

    As you can clearly see through traceroutes, we now have BlackLotus active 24/7 on all international-sourced traffic, which does not affect any of our local traffic.

    We achieve this through use of communities through our transit providers, and it's how we and several other hosting companies in Australia utilise the BlackLotus service.

    Should you decide to use the BlackLotus service in future, feel free to get in touch with our technical guys and they will be happy to show you how it's done.

    In the unlikely event that an attack was coming from Australian sources that we are not able to mitigate using our own more basic mitigation techniques, we are able to specify a more specific /24 route to BlackLotus that will temporarily route it overseas for scrubbing, however that will soon be a thing of the past but for commercial reasons I cannot disclose much more on that at the moment.

    I hope this clarifies this for you!
    Cheyne Jonstone
    Executive Chairman
    http://www.ventraip.com.au

  10. #10
    Registered Provider Exigent's Avatar
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    Okay, so you're still actually having all of your traffic scrubbed by Black Lotus internationally.

    What you're really saying is that all of your international traffic is delivered and goes VIA Black Lotus and is scrubbed first before being delivered to Australia.

    Should you see an attack here in Australia, you're rerouting a /24 to Black Lotus to scrub internationally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cheyne View Post
    Should you decide to use the BlackLotus service in future, feel free to get in touch with our technical guys and they will be happy to show you how it's done.
    I'll keep it in mind thanks. We're really happy with our DDOS protection that we have with Micron21. We don't need to ever send any traffic out of Australia to have it scrubbed or cleaned which really is a great bonus to us keeping everything for us here in Australia.

    We always see those stating on public sites/forums about latency and keeping our ms down to around 30-50ms is far better then it reaching 280+ ms because it's being rerouted/delivered internationally.

    The guys at MicroN21 have built a really great DDoS protection system (in my opinion a very strong & reliable system). One of the many great advantages to Micron21 is that it's not just 1 DDoS protection system that they're opting to use but a few with the likes of NSFocus and A10 Network gear.
    www.exigent.com.au :: sales@exigent.com.au :: 1300 252 080
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  11. #11
    VentraIP Australia Cheyne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exigent View Post
    Okay, so you're still actually having all of your traffic scrubbed by Black Lotus internationally.
    I'm a little confused. Why does it matter where it is scrubbed? Even if you used Arbor cloud signalling the actual scrubbing doesn't take place in Australia, it's send to scrubbing centres internationally.

    And I hate to break it to you, but Micron21 are scrubbing their traffic internationally as well since the majority of DDoS traffic comes from overseas sources. I can assure you now that they're not allowing it to come over from the US and then scrubbing it in Melbourne!

    Should you see an attack here in Australia, you're rerouting a /24 to Black Lotus to scrub internationally.
    No that's not what I said. Let me say it again.

    We have other methods to deal with the smaller scale attacks that tend to originate locally, and if (and only if) we are unable to mitigate it locally we will send it overseas.

    And again, that will soon not be the case.

    We always see those stating on public sites/forums about latency and keeping our ms down to around 30-50ms is far better then it reaching 280+ ms because it's being rerouted/delivered internationally.
    You see a lot of things on public forums, doesn't always mean they are true. You should know that.

    Our latency to BL is ~195ms so I'm not sure where you get 280ms+ from. But I would prefer to keep our traffic in each state then have everything sent to Melbourne first, since that is something our customers have complained about for the last three years and we've finally been able to correct that this week with our move to NextDC S1 in Sydney.

    it's not just 1 DDoS protection system that they're opting to use but a few with the likes of NSFocus and A10 Network gear
    I know James, David and the team at Micron21 very well, and I have no doubt knowing James that it's a great system since he doesn't tend to do things by halves. We would consider using it ourselves if we didn't already have such a great relationship with BlackLotus, but we continue to use BL because they are purely a DDoS mitigation company, it's what they do day in day out and they do it extremely well both for us and many other Australian customers.

    However, what you have just said makes no sense.

    Micron21 use the same NSFOCUS equipment that BlackLotus use, but the A10 equipment (which are AX 3200-12 load balancers) is used for load balancing high traffic sites which they host and WAF purposes, unless something has changed in the last two months.

    A10 do have a line of DDoS mitigation hardware known as the Thunder TPS appliance, which comes in at a list price of $200k per unit and have a base scrubbing throughput of 38Gbit (which is around the mid to high level of the NSFOCUS gear), but so far it's not in use by anybody who does DDoS mitigation as a service.

    I'm not quite sure why you decided to turn this thread in to a "mine is better than yours" type situation John, but we do what is best for our business and our customers, and I'm sure you do the same for yours. Let's just leave it at that.
    Cheyne Jonstone
    Executive Chairman
    http://www.ventraip.com.au

  12. #12
    Registered Provider Micron21's Avatar
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    Dear All

    I would like to correct some of the incorrect statements above.

    However I’m not interested in entering a who’s better than who’s contest as comparing a local Australian DDoS protection Provider to a USA DDoS protection provider is the same as comparing shared hosting in the USA to shared hosting in Australia argument.

    Micron21 has both cleaning capacity within Australia in Melbourne and we have cleaning capacity internationally in LA, and in the future Singapore and Amsterdam will be added to further protect our customers.

    We clean international traffic internationally (Layer 3 to 7)

    And we clean domestic Australian traffic domestically (Layer 3 to 7)

    At no time do we route local domestic Australian traffic overseas to be cleaned, this is our MASSIVE point of difference between our services and say Black Lotus as we pride ourselves in delivering an Australian solution for Australian Networks which want to be protected locally.

    On the flip side we do not compete with Black Lotus, as they provide DDoS Mitigation services only from the USA verses Micron21 is an Australian DDoS protection provider designed to provide local protection for Australian networks and businesses.

    The A10 AX 3200-12 whilst primary function is an ADC it has a large amount of DDoS protection built into it ASIC not just WAF which forms an integral part of our mitigation cannon.

    On top of the AX series of products we also use the Thunder products, in fact we are the first thunder cloud provider in Asia Pacific. Detailed information on the Thunder cloud product offering which includes both hardware and software is here - aCloud Services Architecture with our customer testimonial at the bottom of the above link

    I can comment that the only TPS device in Australia is currently in the eastern parts of Melbourne ;-)

    Worldwide the A10 TPS product (only just released) is in “proof of concept” and a 10gbit TPS is also being released at $60k RRP

    Kindest Regards
    James
    Last edited by Micron21; 27-03-2014 at 12:51 PM.
    Outer East Melbourne Datacentre – Micron21 Pty Ltd
    Co Location – Dedicated Servers – Web Hosting – VMware Cloud Solutions – 24/7 Support
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  13. #13
    VentraIP Australia Cheyne's Avatar
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    Awesome!
    Cheyne Jonstone
    Executive Chairman
    http://www.ventraip.com.au

  14. #14
    Registered Provider Micron21's Avatar
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    Lovely...

    Now back on topic... perhaps we should run a leader board ...

    Kindest Regards

    James
    Outer East Melbourne Datacentre – Micron21 Pty Ltd
    Co Location – Dedicated Servers – Web Hosting – VMware Cloud Solutions – 24/7 Support
    Phone 1300 76 99 72 (Email) James@micron21.com
    www.micron21.com

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Micron21 View Post
    Lovely...

    Now back on topic... perhaps we should run a leader board ...

    Kindest Regards

    James
    Yeah that sounds like a good idea.
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